'The subject of the cabinet is complex and open to all possibilities'
Iyad Allawi, head of the interim Iraqi government, who chose, with his Movement of National Accord (MNA), a position outside the sectarian and ethnic alignment that emerged from the country's first democratic elections for decades, takes pride in being described as a "liberal". He believes that liberalism is "the soundest way to lead to a true democracy and thus to build a modern Iraq". In the wake of the January 30 elections and during the transitional stage following it, we met with the prime minister at his headquarters in the Green Zone, transformed into a fortress under particularly tight security to guard against possible attacks. ? Thanks to the efforts of Rafik Hariri, a qualitative leap forward was achieved in Iraqi-French relations
? So far, we haven't achieved a positive atmosphere with Syria
Declaring himself satisfied with the results of the elections, which made him the leader of the most important parliamentary bloc belonging to a single political current and having no open or tacit alliances, he spoke of the matters of the hour: Iraqi-Syrian relations in the light of the tensions characterizing them; Iraqi-French relations, disclosing the great part played by the late Prime Minister Rafik Hariri in improving them and giving them a qualitative leap forward; relations with the Islamic Republic of Iran and other neighboring countries; the state of security; the debts and the means of paying them.
The MNA obtained 40 seats in the legislature
Are you satisfied with the results of the elections? What were the strong and weak points?
The election was a great and important event for Iraq and its future. There were positive and negative aspects to the polls, which was not surprising since they were the first real popular consultation in decades in Iraq, which lived so long under the thrall of dictatorship.
As head of a list of candidates in the elections, how do you read the results of the elections?
The results were excellent if one takes account of the reality of the battle and its political implications. Our list obtained an honorable proportion of the seats in the National Council [Parliament]. It wasn't the list of a political coalition and it had to compete with some strong coalitions. The most important list was supported by the Shiite religious leadership. In taking account of all the votes cast and dividing them among the parties and groups that took part in the elections, we can say with certainty that we obtained the majority. In fact, dividing 140 seats among 16 parties, in addition to other personalities and groups, the totality of seats in relation to parties and groups varies between 8 and 10. The NAM alone won 14 seats.
Contact maintained with Shiite religious leadership
Does your movement still have reservations about the sponsorship by Ayatollah Ali Sistani of the Unified Iraqi Alliance? And how do you see your relations with that leadership? Do you maintain contact with it?
Our relations with it are excellent and there is no tension. But I don't know why that leadership has decided to take the side of one camp against the other. In any case, we respect its decision, though we are not committed by it.
When will the new cabinet be formed?
This will take time. Complex talks are now going on and they will be long and difficult. Agreement has to be reached not only on who will be prime minister but also on who will preside over the National Council, on the members of the cabinet and the distribution of ministerial posts. This will all take a month at least.
Might continuing differences about the composition of the cabinet open the way to the maintenance of the interim government that you lead?
That's one of the possibilities. Basic missions of the National Council are to draft a new constitution and to pave the way for national reconciliation.
Will contacts with representatives of the Sunnites who boycotted the elections have any significant results? Will their participation in the cabinet make up for the gap arising from their boycott?
Effective approaches must be made with all sections of the population, especially with those who didn't take part in the elections. In my view, this fundamental matter must be dealt with during the next stage. Any new cabinet will need to address vital questions concerning the country's future, among them national unity, reconciliation, deepening the democratic system, development of political action and drafting a new constitution.
An open door to dialogue with Damascus
One detects considerable tension in your relations with Syria, to the point where the media cast suspicion on or accuse Damascus of harboring elements who carry out terrorist operations on Iraqi territory after they have undergone training in camps set up for that purpose in Syria...
I'm making great efforts myself on this matter and I've shown to our Syrian brothers the information we have on this subject. Unfortunately there's been no positive reaction on their part. I'm not telling a secret when I say that these elements have cause great damage to Iraq. I've spoken about this to President Bashar Assad and other officials and proposed coordinating our efforts in order to supervise our common border and restrain the activities of these disruptive elements.
Have you despaired of reaching an arrangement with Damascus?
Not at all. We continue to feel affection and respect for Syria. The door remains open to whoever wants to make a contribution to normalizing our relations.
Have you asked Syria to hand over the elements you mention and to stop the media campaign?
That in fact is what we'd like. But it's not a question of supervising our common frontier, which isn't impossible. The problem is the troublesome elements inside Syria. They're benefiting from Syrian hospitality in order to spread the germs of strife among us.
US pressures on Damascus
Do you think the pressures put on Damascus by the US from Lebanon are the result in the delay in dealing with this issue?
For my part, I've made approaches to the United States and Europe in order to calm the atmosphere and prepare the way for a direct dialogue. Following my initiative, a mixed Syro-Iraqi commission was set up, which the US has joined. This commission held two meetings, but later everything was blocked. So far, we haven't succeeded in ensuring a positive atmosphere and we hope that Syria is aware of the gravity of the situation and will take steps to preserve its interests and ours. The fact is that Syria has welcomed elements who once fought against the regime of Saddam Hussein. It's unreasonable for Damascus to shelter people who once plotted against Syria
The pressures now being exerted by Washington on Damascus are motivated, in part, by the situation in Iraq.
So is all possibility of reaching an understanding ruled out?
I don't think so. Syria is called on to cooperate seriously with Iraq. In any case, the language of dialogue is the best language.
What of Iraqi-French relations? Is there still tension?
A qualitative leap forward has been achieved in this respect, and I can tell you in all frankness that it was made possible by the efforts of the martyred Prime Minister Rafik Hariri, who played a great role. I met him for the first time at Geneva airport and we discussed our relations with France. Hariri then got in touch twice with President Jacques Chirac from his private plane. They exchanged points of view, and Hariri expressed the hope that relations between Paris and Baghdad should be normalized. He also hoped that France would reconsider the debts Iraq owed to France, and he informed Chirac that their conversation was taking place in my presence. He presented me as a serious, frank person who wanted to establish the best relations with France. To tell the truth, from that moment French-Iraqi relations improved and the Iraqi president was invited to Paris.
How would you describe Iraq's relations with neighboring states?
They're excellent and there are no disputes between us, apart from the problems with Syria. We also expect greater help from Iran and a more active coordination in favor of our country.
Iraqi-Iranian tension
Tension is less with Teheran than with other capitals. The Islamic Republic doesn't give shelter to elements of the former regime, but it allows passage across its territory to salafists [religious extremists] coming from Pakistan and Afghanistan. There are other matters we hope to settle soon. We were expecting the situation on the Syrian side would be calmer than on the eastern side. I have more than once advised Syrian officials that they shouldn't try to liquidate their accounts with America through Iraq, and that dialogue is always the basic discourse to adopt.
Is security in Iraq deteriorating or improving?
Generally speaking, we've seen an improvement. When I took office, almost all Iraqi cities were destabilized, as was a large part of Baghdad. We managed to put an end to the rebellion in Najaf and the revolt of Moktada Sadr. We were thus able to rebuild the city, pacify Basra and consolidate security in the South. Then we won Fallouja, Samarra and Mosul, where reconstruction has begun. We have accomplished many things and stopped many perverted elements after reconstituting the army and police forces and set up an intelligence service. While dealing blows at the evil forces, we have begun a dialogue with all sectors of Iraqi society, even those belong to the Resistance; I have insisted on this. Now, after the elections, if the new government doesn't strengthen the military and security units in order to consolidate the foundations of the economy and preserve national unity by strengthening it, there will be serious setbacks.
Balkanization?
Do you fear the balkanization of Iraq?
If the new government doesn't set out on the path I've just indicated, the situation will move in a bad direction. In other words, if the government doesn't tackle the task of building a state of institutions, it will have a hard time managing public business and no one can predict what the outcome will be.
As far as I'm concerned, we've accomplished many things on the economic and financial levels. We've greatly reduced the public debt and established the parity of the national currency.
How far has the public debt burden been eased?
By between 80 and 90 percent on a total of 120 billion dollars. While reining in inflation, we've also managed to stabilize the exchange rate of the Iraqi dinar, as you've done in Lebanon. But the job market is still weak and the investment level is low because of the security situation. Those who follow us will have to tread the same path.
'Lebanon in my heart'
What are your plans if you leave the premiership?
I'll be active in Parliament and within the Movement of National Accord and in politics generally.
If you were offered a ministerial portfolio, would you accept it?
No. I personally will not be taking part in the future government team.
Would the Movement of National Accord be represented in the cabinet if it was asked to join?
That depends on the orientations and program of the government. We'll study that at the proper time. I'd prefer to be in the opposition, but in any case the final decision will be taken by the MNA. Right now, an alliance is being made between the forces committed to a political religion and the liberal forces I belong to.
Are you against a state religion?
There is in Iraq a political Islam and there are liberal forces. Our action must take place in Parliament, not in the cabinet, because of the existence of fundamental antagonisms in points of view concerning the constitution and the management of the everyday business of the Iraqi state.
How would you describe your relations with Lebanon?
Lebanon is in my heart, and when I no longer have any official or party responsibility, I'll try to have a house in Lebanon where I can spend some of my time.
Are official Lebanese-Iraqi relations developing positively?
Certainly, and I have always worked for this objective. During my visits to Beirut, I have reached understanding on a number of measures and initiatives aimed at reactivating our trade relations. We've also discussed strategic projects such as reserving a port for Iraqi use, and we envisage attaching Lebanon to the Arab gas network. And we've also raised the subject of refineries.
My hope is that the future Iraqi government will continue on the same path. If strategic projects of common interest to Lebanon, Iraq and Syria can be achieved, it would benefit all three countries and the whole region.
Monday Morning 2005
